Zorak Zoran and Fire

[Snoof]

Zorak Zoran (whose runes are Disorder, Darkness and Death, according to the Guide) wields Fire as a weapon, despite being a Darkness deity. I figure that means his cultists can too, am I mistaken?

How’s this work, mechanically? Is it a “Master of Fire” feat (or similar) only available to devotees? Can one of his affinities be used directly by initiates to generate Fire effects? Some other method? If it is a feat or direct use of an affinity, which rune is it associated with?

[Niall]

I think it would be as a feat, as the Zorak Zorani will have completed the Hill of Gold heroquest, stealing Yelmalio’s Fire.

[Niall]

And a separate ability.

*Why can’t I edit my posts?*

[boztakang]

Here’s the approach I’ve taken to the fire aspects of the cult…

Fire Rune for Zorak Zoran Worshippers:

During the Great Darkness, Zorak Zoran defeated the little sun upon the hill of gold, and stole the powers of heat and flame from him. Worshippers who have duplicated this feat and won the fire rune can use it to set or control fires, and to dominate spirits of flame. They can augment or enchant their weapons to burn or glow with unnatural heat. These Initiates can also resist burns, and are immune to the normal trollish fear of fire.

Initiates strong in this rune are Overbearing, Demanding, and Uncaring.

A Feat available to Devotees:

[fire] Fire Eater
When Zorak Zoran first saw the infant sun, he immediately recognized its evil and decided to eat it. Sadly, it was too strong for him and disfigured him with terrible scars. Later, when he faced Yelmalio on the hill of gold, he was unfazed by the light and smote the little sun and stole its heat. Now Zorak Zoran can withstand and control fire, though it still hurts him.

and finally – an example Zorak Zoran spirit society:

Spirit Society: [fire] Anmanstan the Stolen Flame

Anmanstan is the spirit of Fire that Zorak Zoran tore from Yelmalio on the hill of gold. Temples that support this spirit society keep him chained in a special restricted area where only society members, heroes, and powerful priests are permitted access. Zorak Zoran is the only god of darkness able to control and contain this evil and foreign power, and other trolls are deeply terrified of this spirit and its powers.

Abilities Granted
• You are unafraid of fire, and even seek to spread it.
• You may capture and use spirits of fire, and charms containing them.
• You can withstand heat and fire far better than other trolls.

Limitations
• You are considered dangerously insane by non-cult-members.
• You smell terrible to other trolls. Burnt hair, charred skin, and a general odor of smoke and danger surround you at all times. Normal trolls are extremely uncomfortable in your presence.
• Fire is still a fundamentally foreign power. The hero point cost to gain or raise any fire-related ability is double the normal cost.

Typical Charms
• Dzi Pohg [fire] – A tiny spirit of flame, often bound in a small metal box with a hinged lid. It produces a small flame, which can be used to set fire to flammable items, or simply displayed as a sign of the bearers fearlessness. Its taboo is to inhale the smoke of burning weeds held in the mouth.
• Ahz Beztoz [earth] – This is a mineral spirit bound into a normally flammable object, which can keep it cool and unharmed in even the hottest flames. It has no known taboo, but overuse can cause the bearer to cough uncontrollably.
• Mal Lutuv [fire] – This charm takes the form of a bottle or flask, and allows the bearer to increase the size and intensity of fires. Its taboo is to set fires.

[Simon Phipp]

In my Glorantha, Zorak Zoran plucked Yelmalio’s fiery heart out and that members of the Amanstan subcult fire powers.

The Fire Rune through Amanstan is difficult to use and master, for trolls, so trolls spend twice the points to gain and increase their Fire Rune.

I am not keen on Zorak Zoran having a Spirit Society, to be honest, as I do not see them as being shamanic – leave all the spirit stuff to Kyger Litor.

Zorak Zoran should have a Take Fire feat, although Fire Eater would work just as well. I do not think that Amanstan would have any feats, as it did not do anything in GodTime, except be a slave.

I like the HQ1 idea of affinities, rather than HQ2’s feats, so I would give members of the Amanstan subcult a Fire Affinity of Fire Maul, Take Fire, Burn Elf, Frighten Darkness.

Don’t forget that Zorak Zoran stole Fire from Yelmalio, but it burned him, as Aether’s fire burned him before. He is a thief, not a conqueror. Argan Argar, on the other hand, conquered and enslaved Lodril, so his worshippers should be able to use the Fire rune without any penalties (no double cost, for example). Cragspider also has fire and grants access to the Fire rune to her worshippers, again at no extra cost.

So, Zroak Zoran is, by no means, the only troll deity with mastery over fire.

[boztakang]

I totally agree that shamanism is not a focus of the Zorak Zoran cult, but Zorak Zoran’s violence transcends the mere physical, and I just can’t see him exempting spirits from his rage, just because they don’t have bodies. While his tradition is not large, its methods and techniques are sufficiently different from the “normal” darkness tradition to merit being described as a distinct tradition, imo.

the cult also has a ready supply of dedicated part-time practitioners…

Given the violent nature of the cult, Zorak Zoran worshipers often find themselves crippled for extended periods of time, or even permanently. A broken body is no barrier to violence, however. When unable to participate in physical mayhem, cultists turn to the spirit realm to torment and dominate the beings there.
Most temples and warbands have several old cripples and injured youngsters who keep themselves busy stalking the spirit world, seeking entities there to serve as allies or slaves or to be bound into weapons, armor, or other charms.
Though better than indolence, this is not considered to be prestigious work, and most trolls return to active combat as soon as their bodies allow. It is relatively uncommon for a Zorak Zorani to awaken their shadow and become a full shaman.

I do disagree wrt Argan Argar “mastering” fire. Sure, he defeated Lodril, and made him build a castle, but I don’t see AA or his followers demonstrating any actual direct fire abilities themselves. Argan Argar has much better defense against fire than many darkness deities, but I don’t see him granting a fire rune to his worshippers. I believe that Zorak Zoran is the only “normal” way for a troll to gain the fire rune, or display

Cragspider, while possibly a counter-example, is a demigoddess in her own right and an avid and prolific Heroquester, who could have gained her fire power any number of ways unavailable to other uz. I suspect she got them through the cult of Zorak Zoran, but she’s individually powerful enough that that doesn’t necessarily need to be the case.

[Robin Mitra]

In my understanding Zorak Zoran’s use of fire is very limited and basically restricted to combat and destruction. He could not use the ability to forge armour or to cook a decent meal (yuck!).

As such I don’t see him possessing a fourth rune. I rather think that to him fire is a breakout ability of the disorder rune.

As reference I would point Orlanth who uses lightning not with the fire rune but with his air rune.

Maybe the upcoming 13th age book will shed some “light” on this 🙂

[boztakang]

that is correct, Zorak Zoran still just has his traditional three runes, it is just that his cult provides tho only “acceptable”(ish) way for uz to gain access to the fire rune, so it is described under his cult.

“Zorak Zoran is associated with the runes of darkness, death and disorder. Especially powerful worshippers can Heroquest to gain access to the fire rune, which is otherwise unavailable to trolls.”

It does make sense to make the destructive focus of the affinity more explicit.

The less said about the vile human habit of burning nearly everything they eat, the better. Disgusting.

[Mark Mohrfield]

I seem to recall someone suggesting that ZZ held the dread secrets of the barbecue pit.

[boztakang]

Zorak Zoran once roasted the back half of a Dragon over an open flame-pit to intimidate Karrg before a Legendary Trollball match. (Which he won, but only because Karrg’s team had to stop playing to fight the front half of the Dragon) The incident became known as Tail-gate, and Zorak Zoran teams have since made a tradition of duplicating the feat (usually with lesser prey) before important games.

Unsurprisingly, traditionalist trolls are equally scandalized by the burnt food, and the implied threat of cheating that such meals represent.

The “cheating” occurs when the living portion of the meal is released on the trollball pitch at some later point – a practice called “streaking” due to the large amounts of blood normally left behind by the victim. Such “streaking” rarely affects the outcome of matches anymore, but the crowds love it despite official disapproval.

[Charles]

ZZ, fire, tail-gate, streaking and more! Awesome, love it!

[Author]

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