Combat Heavy Game in Heroquest?

[Adam]

Hello all!
I have owned the Heroquest 2 rules for awhile have read them on and off as I really like the idea of a narrative, easy to run game that can be used in just about any setting. Lately I’ve been thinking of trying to use it to run a Warhammer 40k game (I have read the FFG rules but I just don’t want to bother with all the +% for this and -% for that type modifiers) I am leaning towards an Imperial Guard game using the community rules to reflect the players’ regiment as they are sent to capture a planet.

Reading the Heroquest 2 rules it seems like combat can often be done with one contest roll, which would really take the steam out of a military style campaign. I’m sure the is a way to run such a game in Heroquest by framing the contests correctly, but my limited imagination can not seem to come up with more than, “Player A, ok, I use my Lasgun at 4W to kill the rebels,” and then the appropriate success or failure is determined and the target is dead, injured, flees to safety. Combat over.

I’m hoping some Heroquest experts on this board can help me get past this roadblock in my understanding for the rules!

Adam

[Simon Phipp]

For me, one of the strengths of GQ was that you could abstract combat to a single contest.

I suppose you could use an Extended Contest, if they still exist in HQ2, or a series of chained contests from Mythic Russia. It would be quite messy, though, and probably wouldn;t work how you want it to.

RQ/Legend, however, would work exactly how you seem to want it to work.

[Simon Phipp]

I really need to get a new keyboard, one with the letters on and not worn out by overuse.

For GQ, read HQ …

[boztakang]

sure, you CAN dispose of entire battles with a single (or no) contest, but if your story is About combat, then it would be silly to do so.

It is all about how you set up what a contest is. In a political game, you might dispense with a six-month siege in a single simple contest, but in the game you describe you might use several simple contests and an extended, just to get through a two-minute skirmish.

ie:
“you face off against the foe, shouting insults back and forth – how do you break their morale?”
“roll to determine your relative terrain advantages, and describe how you are using the environment against the enemy”
“WAUGGGGH! the orks charge firing blasta bolts everywhere, how do you avoid getting fried?”
“big green boiz close and tries ta choppa yu hed – extended group melee battle!!!”

Each scene has potentially interesting consequences which can effect how the story plays out. If your players score a Complete victory on the insults, perhaps the orks run away, and they have to face a huge battle-mech thing instead – if they fail horribly, they might fight a long miserable flanking action, eventually finding themselves deep behind enemy lines just in time to scrag the enemy commander from behind, and grab glorious victory.

It does take a while to get out of the old “they attack, we attack they attack we attack” mindset (or at least it did for me) but once you do, it can make for some pretty fantastic stories and gaming.

[Robin Mitra]

I agree with Boztakang.
I love HeroQuest because you can use it for any genre, setting or scale you like. It all depends on framing the contest. Yes, you can solve an entire battle with a single die roll. And you should do so if the outcome is not that important. Still, during the same battle other things might be of major importance. Will the players manage to kill King Harold during the Battle of Hastings? This obstacle might take a full game session and multiple extended contests to solve.

[Harald Smith]

Having just completed some extended combat in my PbF HQ2 game, I can say that it works very well for that (without having the often agonizingly detailed hit points of say RQ3 which I ran for a long time).

In HQ2, you want to set up a series of obstacles in the combat itself. For instance, squad A must penetrate through the outer defenses. That in itself becomes an Extended Group Contest against the opposing force. Depending on number of players and the level of opposition, that will probably take 5+ rounds to narrate through.

They’ve penetrated the defenses, now they must navigate through the inner complex and avoid being spotted. Also an Extended Contest, but perhaps drawing on Infiltration skills instead of combat.

They get through unchecked. Now they must take out the Command Center. Big, final battle. Hard opposition to fight through, another Extended Contest. Perhaps deterred, or stymied, or hurt. They get a breather, heal a bit. Go at it again in another Extended Contest. And take out the Command Post.

Allows for a lot of dramatic narrative. Depending on what is going on elsewhere, there may be situational bonuses or penalties that affect the players, but they get to be the spotlight within a much larger battle context (and you could establish group stats for the larger battle for the players to roll as well to set the broader scene too).

As Robin and Boztakang noted, if the combat isn’t important to the story, then make it a single roll. If it’s the centerpiece, then frame as multiple scenes, each with critical extended contests to provide the drama. HQ2 works nicely for both.

[Sergi Diaz]

Apart from what everybody is saying, one piece of advice: if a player can die make it into an extended contest always. It feels really cheap to die on a simple contest.

[Roko Joko]

You could also try –

* Switch the game to rounds (blocks of game time). If anything is being contested in a round, run one or more contests.

* If you have an idea of what you want to happen in combat (and what would make it interesting – you do have to envision that) you could specify what some of the abilities on character sheets will be before the game starts.

[Phil Nicholls]

Hi Adam,

I have been running HeroQuest for a couple of years now, and we typically use an Extended Contest for combat encounters. These do not run quite the same way as they would in an f20 game, but there are enough similarities to convey the feeling of a combat.

HQ can require quite a shift in expectation from many of the traditional RPGs, but it is worth the effort for the flexibility of the game.

Best of luck
Phil

[Ian Cooper]

Remember the following trick: the outcome of a simple contest can be turned into the first exchange of an extended contest.

The Shadows of Yesterday (which was itself a love-letter to Hero Wars) used a model of all contests are simple, but if you don’t like the outcome you can ‘Bring Down the Pain’ and go extended. Only a player could Bring Down the Pain in TSOY not the GM

I like this model as it allows players the ability to decide to go extended if a simple contest does not fit their mood, or produces an indecisive outcome, or if they lose and its important to them that they don’t

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